Improving Leadership with Effective Speaking Skills

In this episode, our guest was Rosemary Ravinal talking about Improving Leadership with Effective Speaking Skills.  Rosemary is a Public Speaking Coach and Media Trainer. Rosemary helps business leaders master the art of public speaking to improve their leadership skills. Her clients include AT&T, Toyota, A+E Networks, and Latin GRAMMY.  Rosemary has been working in and helping leaders effectively communicate for many years.

In this episode, our guest was Rosemary Ravinal talking about Improving Leadership with Effective Speaking Skills.  Rosemary is a Public Speaking Coach and Media Trainer. Rosemary helps business leaders master the art of public speaking to improve their leadership skills. Her clients include AT&T, Toyota, A+E Networks, and Latin GRAMMY.  Rosemary has been working in and helping leaders effectively communicate for many years.

The conversation of the episode started with Curt Anderson asking Rosemary about her work journey and asking about her experience being the first Hispanic on air personality at MSNBC. She elaborates on her working journey about being a pioneer in communication leadership here experience at MSNBC, and helping launch the network’s Today show.

Rosemary explained how MSNBC chose her among several Hispanic community leaders to be a representative on the panel.

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Damon and Curt Anderson continue their conversation by asking Rosemary, what are any tips that you would give for guidance improving our speaking skills?

Rosemary advised if you are speaking and see your audience reacting in a certain way, and they’re really excited, you might just want to go off-script. A lot has to do with how you see the audience reacting and you should work with that. When you do this, it opens it up, changes the dynamic, and that can be extremely powerful.

Rosemary tells that when they are in a virtual meeting, there is a tendency to go on and on.  People need to puase and wait for visual feedback.  You also have to factor in latency, and how sometimes sound isn’t optimal. So, it’s important to speak slowly and clearly.

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A call to action would be to look at the way you communicate and find ways ‌you can be more authentic and more true to yourself. Have an attitude of service at the end of a presentation – make sure that everyone has understood and restated your main ideas.

The discussion ends with a thank you to our guest, Rosemary Ravina.

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people, rosemary, pregnant pause, speak, damon, bit, microphone, smile, tips, important, talk, communicating, public speaking, powerful, share, dear friend, hear, kurt, audience, msnbc


Rosemary Ravinal, Damon Pistulka, Curt Anderson


Damon Pistulka  00:06

All right, everyone, welcome once again to the Friday edition. I guess it’s the only edition we do have the manufacturing ecommerce success series. I’m one of your co host, Damon Pistulka. And with me, I have my friend right over there. Kurt Anderson. Take it away, Kurt.


Curt Anderson  00:26

That guy Damon, thank you so much. What I mean a lot of words, because we have a professional speaking coach here today, like I’ve been practicing all week. So let me get into my intro. And ironically, our guest today just put out a blog post of what not to say in an intro. And I probably already done it, but we’re going to dig in anyway. So guys, please a warm, heartfelt welcome to our dear friend, Rosemary Revenant. Rosemary, happy Friday. How are you?


Rosemary Ravinal  00:52

Terrific. I’m going to point A right back to you and say thank you. I was thrilled to share the screen with both of you. And looking forward to a great conversation.


Curt Anderson  01:02

Well, I just you know, so now I’m going to slide into a little bit of an intro. So you have so first off I have to talk about it. So welcome to the program. Dan bigger we got started right on time, my friend. So here we go. A couple of people are wondering where we are we start at 130 to 10:32am. Here we are.

So guys, Rosemary is a dynamo. She is a pioneer. She has a vast history of you know corporate career. at&t Avon we were just talking about I believe a&e Channel, the History Channel, Univision. Who am I leaving out? Does Discovery Channel Sony Toyota, so kind of the who’s who that you’ve worked for? When in your taglines I’d love you know, your smile is your superpower. And so this can you talk let’s start there rosemary, talk about how is your smile your superpower.


Rosemary Ravinal  01:52

This smile is the universal language. It doesn’t matter if we’re talking about manufacturing or aerospace, whatever. We’re talking about human beings connecting. Yeah, and the smile is one of those very powerful facial expressions, perhaps the most powerful that transcends language and culture. And it’s the one thing that you can bring to any conversation, particularly in a virtual digital setting where we don’t have more than two senses to bring a human quality to the communication.

So when you’re smiling and people know whether it’s a fake smile, like a person’s lips smile or a natural smile, but you’re showing a little teeth, that sort of breaks down the barriers. It makes you a friendly person with which to engage and people’s receptivity opens up. So it is something we sometimes forget to do because we’re so caught up in getting it right and not forgetting what we want to say. Right and staying on time. And making sure we look good. And the best thing you can do to energize any conversation is to start with a smile.


Curt Anderson  03:00

So man yeah just made me smile. You warmed my heart and made me smile. Good rosemary. So again, what I absolutely love so first off can please connect with rosemary here on LinkedIn yet absolutely want to check out her website. It’s her Right Rosemary You have a newsletter that you know I get a ton of newsletters and sometimes you know, be mindful, respectful.

You know, we’re all busy. It’s hard to read through everybody’s newsletters sends out I read yours religiously your tips are just off the charts. Absolutely phenomenal. Now, I want to cite in one thing you talked about, you know, it’s universal, though that smile is universal. You have a great track record history. You are a pioneer in communication leadership. You were the first Hispanic at MSNBC. Is that drive that correct? The first country back


Rosemary Ravinal  03:44

in his inaugural season?


Curt Anderson  03:47

Sure, a little bit like what was again, like as a pioneer. And you know, David, I’m just usually I do this at the end. I’m going right here the beginning. We’re girl dads, we are so proud of our daughter. And what we love are inspirational women like yourself that just you know for this next generation. Share with us that story about how you broke that ceiling there at MSNBC.


Rosemary Ravinal  04:07

Yes, it was a really a career highlight. And there is there are highlights, there’s a highlight reel on my YouTube, which is a little bit of sort of obscure because obviously that was a long time ago. And it is something that I’m so proud of because I was chosen among several Hispanic community leaders, communication leaders in New York in the New York City, tri state area to be a representative on the panel of contributors that would really bring the Latino point of view into the conversation.

So at the time they were experimenting with the format that we now see has evolved and we see MSNBC in a very different more mature format right of course adjusting to the times we live but it was a was sort of breaking out of the news mold and into more of a opinions from people who represent the viewership weighing in impromptu unguided on the news of the day. And that was extremely challenging.

So I was the, the interview process and the audition process was rather simple. I had already been vetted because of my leadership in various community organizations. But the that first day on set was absolutely awesome. Because, you know, I’m I, it’s live, you don’t have a rehearsal? Yeah, you’re sitting there around a table, and they don’t even give you at the time, they didn’t give us the topic of the day. So how can you anticipate what you’re going to say? And make sure they were just saying is not only intelligent, but that is representative of the people you are there know, to?

To advocate for nice, right? So how can I be aligned with Latinos who are watching but still be sound like I know what I’m talking about? That was an extraordinary training opportunity, because it’s just going in blind. How do you interact with the other panelists? How do you I mean, it was the time of Katie Couric, for example. Right? And it was, it was just formidable, because it really forced me to say, Okay, I’m here, I am going to do my best I’m going to be respectful of my other panelists, I’m going to be a little bit controversial because the sparks is what drives ratings for, and I’m going to say, if I don’t know the answer to something, I’m gonna say, I don’t know.

But I do know about this. So it was an immensely valuable stepping stone to really a future, and very successful career as a corporate spokesperson. And because of that being sort of a cornerstone, I feel that I bring all of this vast experience to the work I’m doing now with clients. So it was, I would say, is probably the most difficult thing I did for over a year. And I loved every second of it.


Curt Anderson  06:57

Wow, that is awesome, guys. So Daymond this is gonna be so good. So when we want to give a big hello to everybody here today, Dad James, Dan bigger, my dear friend Vale. So guys, this is a treat. And so let’s tie into this. So our program manufacturing ecommerce success, rosemary, when we were just talking about before we went live, what does this have to why is this relevant for our manufacturers? And you just you man, you’d like drop the mic before we even went live? You shared with us a comment of what why is public speaking so important? Could you please kind of enlighten our folks on that comment there?


Rosemary Ravinal  07:31

Well, public speaking is the most important soft skill that you can have in business period. It doesn’t matter what your industry is. It could be manufacturing, aerospace, biomedicine, whatever it is, you need to communicate your ideas to people, you need to explain what you do.

Now, of course, you may not always be in leadership, but you still need to interact with others in a way that creates harmony in a way that advances not only your point of view, or what you bring to the solution, but it also brings people together, it unites people around a common cause. If you don’t speak, if you don’t let now when I say speak, there’s people who don’t have the use of your voices, but speak in other ways. Yes. So we’re talking about communicating your ideas.

The power of the personal voice is so extraordinary, it transcends really any description that we could have. Hence, is why maybe it’s so frightening to people. And we’ll talk about fear of public speaking a little bit later on, because I have a lot to say about that. But look, if you do if you are in business at any level, you need to have fundamental understanding of how to do speaking in public now in public may mean to a small group of people, to your cohorts, to your co workers, it may mean speaking to start up investors, two possible collaborators,

it could be to the bank representative is going to provide your loan, it may be to the person you’re going to choose as of as a soulmate and marry, it may be the commencement speech or the graduation speech that you’re going to deliver. It has many different ways of expressing people fear all of those things because they feel that they are not naturally talented. And that they don’t take the time to prepare. And to you know, like, like exercising, it’s a muscle you need to practice it in order to be good and right. You’re going to be in your little bubble of fear and tension and anxiety. And that’s going to come across


Curt Anderson  09:40

right man and garrison. Oh,


Damon Pistulka  09:43

yeah. Yeah. Here’s yell said Go ahead, Kurt. Sorry,


Curt Anderson  09:47

communicating your ideas. We do need more of this great info again, today, Kurt Anderson and Damon so, so Gail, you’re going to absolutely love this. So you’re just getting a taste or a treat here. You’re with my dear friend, Rosemary. Now, Rosie, I have the honor privilege scale, don’t be jealous. So we’re part of a networking group together. I’m part of this little mastermind, I get to hang out with rosemary every other week. And I am just absolutely in awe and learn. That’s why we’re here today.

And I want to get you guys you have to connect with rosemary and LinkedIn, check out her website. On your website, you have a great quote, I absolutely love this quote. There’s two types of speakers in the world, the nervous, of public speaking and the liars. And yeah, no doubt is that Mark, Mark Twain, I think, Twain, Mark Twain. And so again, guys, if you’re if you haven’t heard me say before, check out her website, check out her news newsletter. But let’s go into a little bit like, you know, you’re talking about how important that communication that soft skill is, let’s take a little step further, that rosemary, just keep let’s just keep this going.


Rosemary Ravinal  10:53

It is, it’s something like it, it comes out in two ways it manifests in two ways. One is the power of the ideas. But you need to have a good grasp of how to synthesize ideas, how to make them concise, how to make them understandable. Because at the end of the day, we’re not talking to ourselves, we’re talking to other people. And one of the things that people who speak in public or who fear speaking in public and fail to understand is that it’s not about me, it’s not a soliloquy just to hear my voice, it’s to communicate with all of you.

And if I’m not connecting, then I’m not successful. As a speaker, I’ve wasted my time in yours. And so if we understand what is it that people need? And how can I be of service? If you put it in the framework of how can I be of service to you? How can I help you be better? How can we help each other, right, collaborate and do things more successfully together? That’s fundamental.

So, the value of the idea the ability to be to synthesize the value, and then to put your own human experience into it, to bring your stories or examples of other stories because stories connect to the heart directly. And the best way to people’s minds is through the heart, through an emotional story where we can relate where we see ourselves in that story. But if you can tell me a story about something that’s totally foreign to me, but if you put it into really human terms, then you can say, Yeah, I felt that way, before I understand what happens, then you really start to pay attention, right, you’re hooked and you want to know more.

So the way people create their content is super important. Then there comes the mechanics of delivery. And that’s something that is also important that can be better learned, it’s easier to learn that than the other because the other entails a lot of other pieces, moving pieces. But the mechanics of it, you can learn at a Toastmaster meeting, you can take a course with me, you can there’s a lot of great tutorial material online, that that helps you understand how to move,

how to modulate your voice, how to use what I call the assets, you know, your appearance, your staging, and styling by staging Sterling, I mean, not only where you are in the virtual set, which is important. These days, this is not going to go away, folks, this pool is going to maybe morph into more of a hybrid where people are going to be co located in one space. And then you’re going to be addressing people who are distributed remotely.

So how do you manage and toggle between the two, that’s a skill that we all have to step up to. But so staging, the appearance, the staging and the styling, where are you physically and with your appearance comes what you wear, what you wear is super important, because that that Telegraph’s to people a sense of pride in your appearance. But it also colors also have a strong psychological impact on people. And maybe it’s brand related, or maybe is your personal brand. So all these things come into play.

Then after the A S S comes E, which is my favorite, which is the energy of the emotion, which has to do with how you use your body, how you use the voice, how you use your facial expressions, your smile, all these things that convey energy and emotion. And then the T is the technology, which in the virtual space means how to use your webcam, how to use your microphone, your lights, you set up how to use the streaming platform effectively on a basic level, plus how to use the microphone on a stage where to look when you are on a stage or a platform or a panel in front of other people. Right?

How do you engage every one? How do you work your audio visual while you’re talking? All this has to do with using your technology successfully. So that’s the more of the mechanical part. And there’s a lot to that as well. But I sometimes will refer to tell people get your essence your idea really solid, your story get that really your narrative well defined because that without that you could have the best mechanics in the world. But if you’re not saying anything, then you’re you’ve lost. You’ve lost your opportunity.


Curt Anderson  15:18

Yeah, no man. This, Damon, you


Rosemary Ravinal  15:23

know, when you hang out with you suffer, and I’m making you suffer David,


Damon Pistulka  15:27

so much in there because they get through the other stuff. And it’s you’re exactly right. And I think back to times when I spoke in public before, it’s like, the first time you get up and you’re trying to run the technology and speak, Where do I stand? Where do I look, all this kind of stuff. And then if you don’t have the material down, so you really understand. and concise as you said, it’s ugly, because I came from a technical background, right?

So you can’t get too technical. You have to be just because of the audience, you have to be able to communicate to everyone in the audience. And I just it’s bringing back nightmares. It’s like nightmares, because I remember the first time I got up to speak, I was like, What’s this microphone? And how do I turn this stuff when you’re doing it? And then I looked at the presentation I did. It was not at the level I should have done for the people I’m like, oh my, but that’s not It’s not bad. It’s just good. It’s good.


Rosemary Ravinal  16:21

There’s so many examples, and we see it every day in some way or another. There’s that one of my favorites is the is the dancing microphone, you can have someone in front of a room, and they forget to keep it here. And so as they’re gesturing, they’re doing this with the microphone, and so their voices is getting farther away. You can’t hear. We don’t realize that they’ve got to keep it here. Yeah, that’s right. And keep it consistently at a certain distance in order, right? It’s hard to do what you’re supposed to do.


Curt Anderson  16:53

You know, the so some great comments here, our dear friend, Nicole Donnelly, how can I be of service that is quoting you? How can I go out service, mind your assets? So there’s a lot of


Damon Pistulka  17:02

money because I actually have the it says Who can I help today in a little post it note on my monitor that I look at every day, just because that is so important. And it’s great that you’re saying that about public speaking because it really is about the audience. It’s not about the speaker, it’s not about that at all.


Curt Anderson  17:19

So let’s go rosemary, let’s go into some deeper tips here. So and Damon you ever hang out with somebody that’s just so professional and polished and poised and then you just realize how you’re not, you know, like, so that’s how I feel when I’m with real like today? Yeah, today. So but, guys, you’re just getting a small taste of just what rosemary, you know disperses and power, sharing all these things. But rosemary, let’s go into you share a enormous amount of tips that I love and enjoy. You talked about the intro, I was reading that, you know, the further ado, you kind of blew up LinkedIn a little bit with, you know, what not to say for an intro versus what to say. Can we touch on that a little bit?


Rosemary Ravinal  17:59

Oh, yes, that was a fun one. It has to do with the ceremonial use of the term. Without further ado, let’s hear from our guests. Damon, without further ado, is something that is used by experienced and inexperienced hosts or introducers. of sorts. And it is. So it’s like you’re ridiculous. It’s like you’re moving along, and then you hit a rock. It’s like, what was that? What why? Without further ado, many cases people don’t even know what it means. Because when I wrote that, that blog, and I posted social people were surprised when I defined what a dual means, right? It’s an MS term that has to do with fuss, right and delay and unnecessary motion without fuss.

So without first let’s get to the program. And it is just it just clutters the speech, you could just as well say it’s now time to hear from our guest speaker Take it away, Damon, right. Right. Right. Yeah, it’s, and then another one of my favorites is our next guest. doesn’t need an introduction. Yeah. And then you get into the long two page introduction. Yeah. If you doesn’t need an introduction, just go right into Yeah. You know, and here’s Kurt Anderson. Yeah, it just becomes if we’re not aware of what they were saying, because it just becomes such a formality that everybody else does it. So you’re, you go along.


Curt Anderson  19:37

Exactly. And I’m curious Damon, if you go back to the show how many times I’ve said that and so as and not like, Oh, my goodness. Yeah. She has tips on like, you know what to eat before a presentation. So not like before I’m doing a workshop before I’m doing this. I’m like, Well, what should I eat? What should I drink? And so you share all sorts of amazing powerful tips. You know, somebody dropped into the comment box here. My first time when I discovered I needed bifocals. I couldn’t look at my notes and see the audience to that is absolutely Oh, yeah, I absolutely love.


Damon Pistulka  20:08

And then Dan did this. And that’s why I laughed and saw her my, my sister, just don’t try to be funny. You’re not funny.


Rosemary Ravinal  20:15

Yes. You don’t know what people are going to think. Yes, uma is a very sticky wicket. It can help you and it can backfire. Yeah, you only use it when you’ve tested it enough that you know it’s going to land, right? But don’t, don’t try it out on a new audience. See, they’re going to remember and hold on to that. And then not be thinking about the first two minutes of what you have to say.


Damon Pistulka  20:43

Yeah, you know, the one thing that you said earlier here, though, that I really, I really enjoy hearing you say is speak from your heart. Because if there’s one thing I’ve learned from corporate until now is that you got to share the facade, you got to show people who you are, you need to really let them see you, because then they can connect with you. And if you don’t, and in my experience anyway, and I’m not a professional by any means. It’s, it just feels better. It feels better to be able to,


Rosemary Ravinal  21:18

but you are a professional because you you’ve been doing this a long time. It’s in a way, when you hear it and it’s done. Well, you know it, maybe you can’t articulate the why. But if you start to study it, and I clearly study it, and I enjoy studying good examples and poor examples and learning from everything that you can tell. And you may not even know have a domain knowledge about what the person is talking about.

But you can sense that there is a ease and a love of the topic, and a love of yourself in giving this information out to people. And it’s very powerful. And that, you know, particularly where we came from the last few years of so much change management and so much disruption. You know, CEOs, leaders, in any industry really need to understand that what they say, carries so much weight. And don’t just read a speech that someone else wrote for you. Speed up put maybe put that aside and just touch on the factual the data points that have to be conveyed, but put your own personality into it. It’s much more effective.


Curt Anderson  22:24

Yeah, absolutely. So I just want to share a couple of things. Here’s some comments that people share about rosemary. And so high level communicator with that prolific career passion for perfection, most professional, creative, ethical and knowledgeable communicator, a communication strategist that I know, enthusiastic collaborator, a rare breed so you guys are just getting a small taste here again of the giant Dynamo that Rosemary has Rosemary what I want to do now let’s take I’m gonna go back in time a little bit you shared a little bit about you know, you’re kicking off you’re not kicking off your career but your career MSNBC,

what inspired you you’re dine in again, you’ve become a dear friend I admire you respect you worship you love hanging out with our time together? How what’s been a key to your success? And like what kind of pulls you in this direction of like sharing your superpower of helping people be better communicators and better leaders?


Rosemary Ravinal  23:21

Yes. I’m going to take a sip of water. And I’m going to answer your question, but because I’m going to take a sip of water with a straw when I have to say that this is one of the tips that I share in what to eat or drink or not. Because when I drink from a straw, and that morning, my lipstick, and I’m also not putting


Damon Pistulka  23:39

I have to remember that I


Curt Anderson  23:42

theme and stop spreading you know.


Rosemary Ravinal  23:45

Thank you. But mostly I don’t have to I don’t have to tip the glass over and maybe demon.


Damon Pistulka  23:51

I know. I know. I know. I gotta get that straw.


Rosemary Ravinal  23:54

But you have to hydrate it’s important to hydrate Yes, that’s right. The so the answer to your question. And this is this is a good one because it forces me to be concise, and give you my best answer. You know, this, this never came easy to me. I do have been public about the fact that for most of my, my early career, I stuttered. I stuttered really badly when I stuttered, because it comes from childhood trauma and it came from being bilingual and having a whole mess with Spanish English, but it had a lot to do with a lot of psychological trauma.

And when I realized that I had this difficulty as a in my college years and well into my first decade as a professional, I tried to hide it in I tried not to speak or I tried to choose words that were safe that I knew I could pronounce. I had a lot of difficulty with s and with P words P P P P and Then I found a coach and I was able to overcome it. But what really helped was the microphone. And I realized quite by accident, I was in journalism school, it was a broadcast journalism major, I had to use a microphone for filming for radio and TV. I tried to avoid it. But when I had to speak into a microphone, it was like, This is it, this is life or death, you got to say this correctly into this device.

There’s no turning back, there’s no do over, you’ve got to get it right. That sense of urgency gave me maybe a prod that said, You’ve got to get your tongue, your lips to do what they’re supposed to do. And that was the beginning of self administered therapy, in terms of the correction or the management, the management of the stammer, you never get rid of it. It’s there. And sometimes when I get a little nervous, or sometimes, like when I have to call like IRS or something, and something I don’t want to do, you know, I start to feel like, Oh, my tongue is a little heavy. And it’s there, it never really goes away, you learn to manage it.

So the career progression was always in public relations spokesperson work, I evolved into higher levels of responsibility. And to the point where after leaving Univision after two years, as head of public relations with a network, I saw my path clear to starting a consulting business to help executives do what I learned to do, both in terms of my, my personal experience, as well as observing others and working with broadcast journalists and, and all that collective skill that I hope will bring a fresh set of techniques that people can adopt. Just not It’s not by, you know, there’s a lot of different ways to teach public speaking.

But what I laid out at the beginning of our time together about it really coming from the heart and being authentic about it being maybe mechanically a little faulty, but you have to speak from the heart. And that that, to me, is really the best way that I can create a transformation and the people who come to me for help.


Damon Pistulka  27:12

That is very cool.


Curt Anderson  27:14

And I love and I want to tie it, you said a couple of things. Earlier, you were talking about like the fear of public speaking. And it doesn’t have to be in front of a crowd or an audience. It can like us, it could be a presentation at work, it could be a co worker, or it could be confronting a challenging situation that you’re uncomfortable with. But I keep referring to your blog and just love your blog. You have butterflies getting your butterflies a fly in formation, getting your butterfly I have never


Damon Pistulka  27:38

fly in formation. That’s awesome. That one, David, so No, I never had a knot,


Curt Anderson  27:43

you have the rule of three butterflies fly information, talk, can you share a little bit of that concept of like, how can we overcome that fear, regardless of what we’re facing? And how do we get our butterflies to fly information? Yes,


Rosemary Ravinal  27:56

it is. It’s not original to me. And I can’t remember exactly where it came from was a bit of an obscure source, but I loved and still love the imagery that metaphor. In fact, I did a video where I put butterflies all over my face in my chest just to illustrate that the butterflies were there. And you can’t make them go away. And sometimes it’s a good thing. It’s almost like you are caffeinated, highly caffeinated. Right?

And so you have that little shaky feeling. And that if you tame that to be your friend and not your foe, and to energize you see, okay, I’m a little jittery. I mean, I can keep my legs from wobbling. Maybe I’ll hold on to the lectern a little bit tighter or maybe not at all. Just place them Jabra gently on top of my notes. You’ll learn how to deal with it and it can energize you. There are some people who go to extremes to get the heart rate going and the you know, the heart pounding. And you know, they had the fast breathing like Tony Robbins.

He makes no secret of the fact that when he does these big, big, big mega rallies, motivational conferences, he does a trampoline. He has a trampoline backstage and he jumps on that trampoline jumping and gets his heart rate, he yells and he just becomes a psycho. And then when he goes on that stage, he’s right. He is all charged. That works for him. Right that works for him and he uses that so we too can use the butterflies fluttering to lift us to a higher level of performance. The worst thing to do was try to tamp in it. Don’t drink glass of wine.

Don’t take a dip of any kind. Don’t go in that direction. You can breathe, do deep breathing is a lot of great breath techniques. I have some of that on my website on my blog about either blowing through a straw or doing a four step breathing cycle. Well, you can meditate, you can visualize a moment of great joy, great success, like the birth of your child, something that brings you joy, where you’re not identifying with the terror of walking to that microphone or that webcam, because again, we have to factor in that some people are still terrified of the webcam, because they can’t see the people at the other end.

So that sense of who’s in there, I can’t talk to a little black circle. It’s people fear that more than actually being in front of like, people. So whatever your scenario is, you know, that you can use that, that it’s really not so much fear, it’s social anxiety, performance, anxiety, you know, it has a name, it has a really weird name. It’s called the colossal phobia, gloss or phobia, like gloss, loss of phobia.

And it is a, a medical term for people for performance anxiety for stage fright. You know, like how your brain goes, brain freezes, and your tongue sort of gets stuck in your mouth and your palms get sweaty, and number of things, some people actually vomit, you know, and that happens still to a lot of lots of great performers who do this kind of ritual, like, gut wrenching thing before they go on stage. And then they go on stage, and they just, you know, bring the house down.


Curt Anderson  31:27

Right? Right, man, this is awesome. You have another title, love is a path to public speaking. And you’ve touched on this, you know, sharing being your authentic self, sharing your passion, so on and so forth. Have you had times, you know, in your prolific career, have you had times where you were on stage, or maybe walked offstage? And you’re like, Man, I could have done a little bit better?

Or other times, you’re like, Man, I just really crushed it on that, you know, what’s been your sense, like either, say, during the presentation? Where if it’s maybe going great, you know, where do you take it from there? Or if it’s not going so great. What are any tips in the midst of a presentation that you would give for guidance? Anybody here that’s a public speaker.


Rosemary Ravinal  32:06

Yes, that takes a lot of courage and a lot of self confidence to go off script. One of the reasons that I chose to go in the direction that I’m in now, having my own consulting practice, is that I was growing a little weary of having to speak someone else’s words, being the corporate spokesperson for my employer. And that’s, that’s part of the job description, certainly. But sometimes one has to say words that you don’t really believe that are not your own. You’re just a mouthpiece, you’re just a conduit for delivering the corporate message.

And when it coincides with your own values and your own sense of purpose, wonderful, but sometimes it doesn’t. And so that’s a little bit difficult, because you’re just reading a script. And that’s unfortunately, something that’s very difficult to work around. Because that’s, that’s your job. So it’s, it’s if you find yourself, if you’re a an entrepreneur, you if you’re your own boss, then of course, you have that latitude, to, to speak from the heart.

And to get off script. A lot has to do with how you see the audience reacting, right? If you see that people are reacting in a certain way to something you’ve said, and they’re really excited, you might just want to go off script. And instead of following what’s on your page, you might want to have a conversation, a q&a, hey, you know what, I’m going to toss my script because I want to hear from you. How does it how does what I am saying sound to you, I want to hear your reaction, it opens it up, and it changes the dynamic. And that can be extremely powerful.


Curt Anderson  33:48

I love that. That’s a fantastic, you know, so let’s go back a couple years ago, I don’t know if you guys heard like, couple years ago, there was like this little pandemic thing that went on. I don’t know if you guys are aware. David, did you know about that at all? So I heard something heard something like something a news or something. But anyway, so dynamic change. So everybody forced the pivot in March of 2020. And now, you know, knock on wood, or hopefully, it seems like we’re kind of coming back out. So now we have live events, people are not flying, there’s no mass on flights. So are we getting back to our old life?

But you know, what is our new life going to look like? So, you know, as we hit a pivot to get online and really have a strong zoom presence, rosemary, what advice you have for folks now that maybe, I don’t know about you guys, but you know, if you became a little socially lazy, you know, now you’re like getting back in person. Are you a little bit awkward, you know, so any advice for folks as we kind of get back out in the world and how they should be approaching to theirs themselves, to be better communicators?


Rosemary Ravinal  34:44

Yes. My advice is to take what you learned from two years on Zoom or teams or whatever your platform of choice was, and use that to bring to the real world. That is if you were paying The attention to doing this rectangle, well, many people who did not step up. And so this is a wonderful place to practice good public speaking techniques.

Because you’re in a very immersive, very intimate, even though we’re not together physically, we are very intimate because we’re looking at each other in ways that we wouldn’t ordinarily in real life. So this is a place to practice your facial expressions, your upper body language, your cadence of speech, and really practice the skills you can bring to your physical spaces. And also, and this is another dimension that’s going to be challenging.

It’s even challenging for me, is how do you work with people who are co located under the same roof that you are? And those that are distributed in other places? And how do you make everyone feel equal? How do you create what’s called Digital parity, and have a sense of inclusion so that people who are there can ask their questions and make their ideas heard and feel like you’re that the speaker is communicating equally with the others? And that this interaction, that’s difficult to do? Yeah, it’s possible. And there’s techniques to do that. But that’s where we don’t I think, need to step up.


Damon Pistulka  36:24

Go ahead, do it? No, that’s, that’s a, that’s a great thing to point out, because we’re going hybrid. I mean, I don’t care what anybody thinks there’s going to be hybrid workers for a long, long time, because we’ve hired remote workers. I mean, we have so that the digital parity is really something, you know, as much as it was, when everyone was digital, or most people were digital, and you’re trying to figure out how do you create a team, when everybody’s not the same room you have to do? Now when people are here and there? It’s, it’s that intentionality of the whole thing has to be there, otherwise, you’re gonna lose people.


Curt Anderson  36:58

Yeah. And I want to, I caught you, I caught in an interview that you did, and it was, you talked, the conversation was a little bit about structural variety. And so a couple of friends on the program. Today, we have John McLean. Oh, Dan bigger there with a SaaS company, amazing, wonderful company of Tessa.

So when they’re doing, say, demos, or for any of our folks out there doing sales, selling themselves on their product, or service on and so forth, you also have a great newsletter, you’re talking about the pregnant pause. So if I’m, if this is a if I can combine these two a little bit, you talk a little bit the value the power of the pregnant pause. And if you recall that conversation and that structural variety of like, how do you mix things up a little bit to get away from like that, that droning on monologue? Can you share a little bit there? Oh, yes,


Rosemary Ravinal  37:42

this is one of my favorite, maybe second favorite topic. The, when we’re on an under virtual meeting, there is a tendency to go on and on and on, there’s also a tendency to read from notes that we may have in front of us, or they may be on screen on the same screen, we’re doing screen share, or we divided our screen so that we don’t forget anything.

So we want to be sure to be reading, that creates a monotone a very robotic way of speaking. And that’s not natural. And we also have to factor in latency, how sometimes sound isn’t optimal, because we’re going through so many circuits in so many different places. And we don’t know even what kind of equipment is on the other side how people are hearing us. So it’s important to speak slowly. And to use this magnificent pause as a way to draw attention back to you. Okay, that what I was gonna say, right? Yeah.


Curt Anderson  38:49

I felt myself like physically like captivated. That was so couldn’t Can we do that? Do that again? Yeah. So goes Mary Rose. Damon. Let’s talk about the pregnant pause real quick. So how? So David, let’s, let’s talk about that for a second. What’s going on in your world right now?


Damon Pistulka  39:13

That won’t be good to talk about. Okay, good job.


Rosemary Ravinal  39:21

Oh. Another technique before we run out of time is before you start speaking, Damon, Take a good inhale. When you inhale, people think, Oh, he’s gonna see something important. He’s getting his lungs ready. He’s going to give me something good. Very, very powerful.


Damon Pistulka  39:45

With me, though, it’s usually because I’m doing this.


Rosemary Ravinal  39:49

But at the same time, you’re allowing people to process what you said, and to formulate their own reaction in their questions. Yeah, because sometimes we just say Better away, and someone may want to say something and forget what they wanted to say, because you will we were just going on chattering away. It helps us as speakers also, to create to think a little better.


Damon Pistulka  40:17

Yeah. Yeah.


Curt Anderson  40:20

Chuck the mic. That was, it was so good. That was so powerful. So, you know, again, we have different walks of life. And I know I’m keeping you because I know you have a, you’re a busy person. And we, I have two more questions for you that I want to chime in to.

So again, as we’re speaking to manufacturers, and maybe they’re in sales, you know, maybe they’re not doing public speaking, per se, but this was just such a powerful, you know, you talk let’s recap a few things real quick, Damon and cover my back on this. We talked, you know, having that real powerful introduction, you know, speaking, clearly communicating, you know, we this great exercise with the pregnant pause, you know, not rambling on a little bit too long, or, you know, my friends in sales called the hate to go there, you know, throwing up on themselves type of thing, right?

How can we be better, you know, a great way to be a great communicator, be a good listener, right? We have two ears, and one mouth. So being a great listener is another great way to be a wonderful communicator. So let’s go here, Rosemary. I have two questions left. Number one, we were singing, speaking to a lot of manufacturers, and you know, labor shortage, workforce development, a lot of challenges.

You’re very familiar with this. We’ve been really encouraging promoting diversity manufacturing, in women, manufacturing, diversity, manufacturing, so on so forth, and for folks that chimed in a little bit late you were the first contributor, Hispanic contributor to MSNBC. What advice suggestions do you have for any small business owners, any entrepreneurs manufacturers out there? What advice or tips you have not? Phenomenal tips on better communication? How could they help diversify their team, their staff, any suggestions there, from your experience,


Rosemary Ravinal  41:58

there’s wonderful people everywhere that you just have to know how to source them. Don’t just go with the people, you know, break out of those networks. Because look, we tend to feel comfortable with people who look and sound like us, maybe went to the same school worship at the same church, go to the same community sports activities, break out of that, and network with people who are in different communities, who can be wonderful resources and referral.

Referral points that can bring you people who have the skills certainly will have the skills, there’s a lot of talent out there, but who may not necessarily be in your radar. So it’s a matter of breaking out of the comfort zone of sameness listening to other communities and but finding those wonderful allies, who can be your guides to understand where the talent resides in other communities.


Curt Anderson  42:57

Yeah, I’m gonna have a pregnant pause right here, Damon, breaking out of your comfort zone of sameness. Yeah. That’s a pregnant pause right there breaking out of your comfort zone of sameness. So that was a very powerful getting a lot of great comments here. Inger Happy Friday to you, my friend, Nicole dropped another comment Curtis step. Thank you for joining us today. So, guys, we’re gonna close out on this.

Rosemary ready for our last question. Well, and you know, what’s maybe question half so I’m asking for a friend. So when you do these presentations, you talk about, you know, presentation, your, you know, drink from the straw. What to wear, like, workout clothes, pajama bottoms, like, should we not be wearing? No, I’m just, I’m just asking for a friend not for okay. But anyway, last question very


Rosemary Ravinal  43:41

quickly, very quickly. I am advocating and find a model a real life set. So everything you see behind me is real. And it’s there on purpose. These are things that make me happy that represent a little bit of my personality dry if you can, if you can, to not use a virtual background. And if you do use a virtual Abeka meeting blur or certainly not the Golden Gate Bridge, please get us a green screen and the proper lighting so that your eyes your gestures can be crisp. Yeah, because if not you look funny and at this point in time two years later, we gotta get this guy’s we have to step up and say enough, right? And because all of this represents who we are, no matter what business you’re in,


Damon Pistulka  44:29

Yep, yeah, that virtual the virtual backgrounds it’s, it’s funny you say that because that is one of the reasons I’ve never used a virtual background is because I don’t like the little fuzzy around you and it just doesn’t just make you look weird.


Curt Anderson  44:42

Especially when you don’t have hair it makes it even worse. So okay, we’re gonna close out on this rosemary. Yeah, and you know what, when we get offline maybe you could give me some some hair advice for but that’s another


Rosemary Ravinal  44:53

out of my league.


Curt Anderson  44:55

We’ll talk about that on Monday. So again, guys, I want you know, as we wind down, down please Can Next with rosemary and LinkedIn, go to her website. I know I’ve said at times, do yourself a favor, just you get a taste of just a powerful tips, advice, suggestions that she has to up your game, reach out to Rosemary connect with her. Rosemary, let’s close out on this. You put out a post recently on the power of the clothes. We’re at the end of the session, what advice suggestions do you have take us? Take us home right now? How do you have a powerful clothes for our friends and family here on the program today?


Rosemary Ravinal  45:31

First, a call to action, a call to action would be to really take a look at the way you’re communicating and find ways that you can be more authentic, more true to yourself and really fall in love with what you’re saying and with the audience. So have an attitude of service at the end of a presentation.

Make sure that everyone has understood restate your main ideas, and give them a call to action. Have them do something to read something to act on something but don’t just let it evaporate. Give your thank you give your acknowledgments but keep the conversation going in the sense of this is this is a call to action to being better at public speaking. That’s the best way to close. The opening is important is to close but you have to have a succinct summary and tell them what you want them to do.


Curt Anderson  46:25

All right. pregnant pause. dropped the mic. So guys, we’re gonna wind down I know we ran over a little bit. So rosemary, thank you. I just want to thank you for your friendship. I just I can’t tell how much admiration respect I have for you. I love our time together. Please again, guys connect with rosemary here on LinkedIn, check out her website. She has all sorts of information. I know you’re working on a book, we have an exciting wound. She’s working on a book theme. And so hint, she has a lot of great things coming out.

It goes if you don’t feel that you’re on top of your game, get old rosemary, she can help you elevate your game. So we wish everybody an amazing, wonderful weekend. Thank you for joining us today. We know how busy everybody is. We never take this for granted. Boy, we appreciate every each and every single one of you for joining us here today. So Damon we’re going to take away but before we do, let’s give everybody could How about?

Could everybody stand up, please? pregnant pause. Let’s give a round of applause for Rosemary for the dynamic and powerful, wonderful presentation. These great tips these great advice rosemary, I am you’re on my mind literally daily. I’m like okay, well what are the rows? It’s like, almost like what would Rosemary tell me to do right now. So anyway, with that, we’re gonna close it out guys. God bless everybody out there. Thank you keep crushing it. This guy. So first off think this person is wonderful, beautiful soul here. And then let’s thank this guy over here. Daymond Take it away, dude.


Damon Pistulka  47:55

All right, Kurt. Thanks so much. The guy over there. Thanks, everyone. Rosemary, thank you so much. It was awesome. Good. Just just just hearing you speak. makes me a better speaker because it’s today. Like it’s just music to your ears. It is thanks so much. And thanks to guests. I mean, people coming back a week, week in and week out. We just love it.

We love being able to do this. Kurt and I honestly we are so blessed. If you don’t think we just sit back and go, How can we get great guests like rotary to come and talk with us every week. We’re just we’re so blessed. And thank you so much for being here. And we’ll be back again next week. And have an awesome weekend. We’re running into spring and summer and better weather and just enjoy it. No, we’re out for


Curt Anderson  48:41

now. Stay safe. Thank you. Thank you

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